Disability Separation to Admin Separation

Discussion in 'Outcomes: Fit, Severance, TDRL, PDRL' started by birchtx, May 18, 2012.

  1. birchtx

    birchtx PEB Forum Veteran

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    Well, to add to my stress levels, on Monday my command will initiate administration separation due to PFA/BCA failures (while I am awaiting findings for a disability separation). They will have 14 days to file the paperwork with Navy Personnel Command and and I must be gone within 30 days after that. This personnel action will cost me about $60,000 plus (a 10% severance disability separation compared to a BCA admin sep) and I will lose my IDES VA ratings; I will have to redo the entire VA process all over again.

    I don't know why the PEB is taking so long with my findings/ratings... My OIC told me that once I get findings, that will take precedence, but until then I will be processed out with a admin sep. So pretty much it's whatever happens first, but I believe my command will speed the admin sep paperwork up so I will be immediately.

    Jason or Mike (Legal Question): Do I have any legal options to slow down this process, or how can I avoid it? What happens if they do admin sep me, do I have any legal options to revert my discharge to a disability separation? Do I have any legal rights, in terms of a stopping this, or to a board (I have 7 yrs Enlisted/2 yrs Officer).

    I looked at the SECNAVINST that stated that Admin Sep's do not supersede or preclude a disability sep, but the other line in that sentence states that finalization must occur prior to the finalization of local commanders admin sep.... Please help and put this is context. Thank you guys in advance!
  2. klamsnacks

    klamsnacks PEB Forum Veteran

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    I'll chime in from the USAF side of the house, but it is DOD reg's they must follow. IF you have an MEB/PEB ongoing, they CANNOT Admin Seperate you. They can Dual Action the case, where by issue you the paperwork of their intent and have it forwarded up the chain of command, but it MUST be paused at a certain step, to ensure that the VA/MEB/PEB portion is taken care of first. Once that decision is made the choices are - PEB results found fit for duty - then they push the Admin Sep. Unfit for Duty then the Admin Sep is no longer applicable, except in some instances they can both make it to the Secretary of (Navy) in this case where that office makes the determination of which way to go. But generally if you are found unfit for duty and have a dual action against you the MEB/PEB findings of unfit for duty will over ride the admin sep. I'm in this exact situation and have been since May of last year with the Air Force.

    Klam
    PM me if you'd like more information or need to chat!

    Injured doing routine PT Training 13 Jan 2011
    Notified of Demotion Action from E-5 to E-4 18 May 2011
    Demotion Appeal denied- Demoted 15 July 2011 - from E-5 to E-4
    Surgery 29 Aug 2011
    Administrative Separation Notication 27 Nov 2011,
    My MEB was initiated on 28 Nov 2011,
    NARSUM signed 30 Nov 2011,
    Verified signed by local MTF 5 Dec 2011,
    VA Comp and Pensions exam 15 Jan 2012,
    Updated NARSUM with VA Findings 28 Jan 2012,
    Mailed to AFPC for PEB - 30 Jan 2012,
    Recieved by VA 4 April 2012,
    Pending Decision Approval VA 10 April 2012,
    Notified of Demotion Action Pending from E-4 to E-3 - 12 April 2012.
    and that's where it sits
  3. birchtx

    birchtx PEB Forum Veteran

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    Thank you so much, I really appreciate it. I think what's getting to me is the threats by my command to kick me out and lose all my VA stuff. I mean it's everyday, I cannot get a break from this place. I believe since they have no clue what the PEB process is, they assume the PRT/PFA action overrules the PEB and that they can use the admin sep.
  4. NDBravehart84

    NDBravehart84 PEB Forum Veteran

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    Have you mentioned this to your PEBLO..... or JAG?
    Bravehart
  5. NDBravehart84

    NDBravehart84 PEB Forum Veteran

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    Have you mentioned this to your PEBLO or JAG? :rolleyes:
    Bravehart
  6. birchtx

    birchtx PEB Forum Veteran

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    I went to JAG and they told me to take the paperwork to them when they put it in and we'll see what happens; my PEBLO has nothing to say, but the PEB processing will be done by the time they admin sep me... Well, seeing how long the PEB findings are taking to come in, I will probably be separated without benefits. Sucks, bad...
  7. pittpan2005

    pittpan2005 PEB Forum Veteran

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    From your posts the PEB has accepted your case, you are just waiting for results. As long as it's non-punative what Kiam said above is correct. They can continue the process and have the admin sep "ready to go," but it can't be finalized until PEB results come in. Unless something changed recently, within a few weeks, they can't separate you until results come in. What part of SECNAVINST are you referencing?
  8. TuffSpot

    TuffSpot PEB Forum Regular Member

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    My MEB is complete and I received AF permanent disability retirement orders last week. A few days later, my commander pushed up a memo through the MEB office to request a 120 day administrative hold to pursue a UCMJ investigation. He's told me it has to do wi stuff like allegedly being late for duty and missing a day of duty; nothing egregious. I had retirement orders, then the action office at AFPC sent me a retraction of the orders. Any advice? I can't find regulations (DoD or AF) that clearly dictate what they can and cannot do. Any suggestions?
  9. alibs

    alibs PEB Forum Veteran

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    Im in the same boat. I knew I can not get adsep while ongoing peb. My command tried, I took it to JAG. Thay called for me and said "No you can't do that" and gave them the instruction.
  10. pittpan2005

    pittpan2005 PEB Forum Veteran

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    That's an interesting one. Are you going to courts martial? Talk with JAG..........
  11. hawkdrivermtp

    hawkdrivermtp PEB Forum Veteran

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    Very interesting. You can still receive UCMJ action during an MEB, just cannot follow through with an admin separation. Seems like you have a good chance of fighting this since your unit held off giving you UCMJ when they had the chance. Seems like they are trying to play dirty now that you get to retire. I agree, go see JAG and have them assist you.
  12. TuffSpot

    TuffSpot PEB Forum Regular Member

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    Yup, my ADC has been with me the last few months. Retained civilian council, too (broke because of it, though). We're holding off acting because all I want to do is to med retire as I was supposed to. NOT trying to bring down the system! It's a bad situation, but how do I prove reprisal???
  13. NDBravehart84

    NDBravehart84 PEB Forum Veteran

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    This kind of thing is happening to much. Do not these leaders know the creed or the ethos, because you couldn't prove it to me by their leadership skills ... :(
  14. TuffSpot

    TuffSpot PEB Forum Regular Member

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    So true. Retirement orders received, and then a few days later a UCMJ investigation pops up? Not suspicious at all!!! Haha! Good thing I have proof of the squadron commander's bigotry...
  15. pittpan2005

    pittpan2005 PEB Forum Veteran

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    As the military disability golden rule suggests, "Do unto others with a disability what you would never want done to you."
  16. TuffSpot

    TuffSpot PEB Forum Regular Member

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    Well, here's a question: My commander issued an Article 15 for sleeping. I am a diagnosed, documented, and med-boarded Narcoleptic, a fact my commander (and the GCMCA) knows. Isn't this illegal?
  17. NDBravehart84

    NDBravehart84 PEB Forum Veteran

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    When I was at a WTU the Commander had a "Wall of Honor" as he called it..... It had all the Article 15's he had issued for situations like yours......... Obviously HE thought it was HIS HONOR to kick soldiers that were already on the ground :mad:. He was relieved of Command after the sucicide rate went up and they got the results of a Climate Of Command Survey.... So I don't Know For Sure... perhaps one of the Moderators have an legal opinion or answer.........
  18. TuffSpot

    TuffSpot PEB Forum Regular Member

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    That's really awful. This sort of action HAS to be illegal. My ADC is, unfortunately, not much help. He scolded me because I went to the group commander (who did nothing) and then the wing commander (O-6), who likewise did nothing. I used my chain of command!
  19. pittpan2005

    pittpan2005 PEB Forum Veteran

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    Just an idea, but you might want to look into a "complaint of Wrongs," under article 1150. Can you be assigned convalescent leave? What about home awaiting orders? The command would have to approve the home awaiting orders, but they might be inclined to do it if your medical condition is causing work problems. Just my two cents.
  20. NDBravehart84

    NDBravehart84 PEB Forum Veteran

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    Pittpan2005 said " The command would have to approve the home awaiting orders, but they might be inclined to do it if your medical condition is causing work problems"
    "I THINK" he ment to say The command wouldn't have to approve the home awaiting orders, but they might be inclined to do it if your medical condition is causing work problems. ;)
    .

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