Time for a FPEB

A-5_Guy

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PEB Forum Veteran
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Well I received my ratings today a NMCSD

20% DoD / 90% VA

Claimed conditions were
1) Pain in right hip
2) Osteoarthritis of Hip, unspecified
3) Intervertebral Disc Degen, Lumbar
4) Radiculopathy, Lumbar region
5) F41.22
6) F43.23
7) Restless Leg Syndrome
8) Periodic Limb Movements of Sleep

Unfitting conditions were Osteoarthritis of Right Hip (FAI) and Right Lumbar Radiculopathy / Foot Tingling

Reading through their findings it really makes me irritated to know that
1) I had no USMC representation on the board
2) They write conclusions like a 5th grader
3) They didn't even comment on some of my conditions, not even in the Category III area. WTF? Over!

Anyways, to say that I'm disappointed to be "re-entering" the IDES process is a complete understatement. I guess it's time to get smart and lawyer up.
 
Best of luck with the FPEB & possible VARR. Probably add another 4 months onto your timeline, but that's 4 more months of AD pay and allowances.

Take the time to see the JAG to help with a statement to the FPEB and continue treatment, additional evidence, anything to help your case.

@FPEB 33% of the board was USMC. Interestingly, only 1 Medical Officer is required to sit on IPEB/FPEB, the others are line officers.
 
I'll definitely be requesting a VARR as it turns out I tore my right rotator cuff pulling the parking brake in the MV-22 up--how's that for ergonomics. From what their saying I might have to have surgery, they also gave me a bunch of non-compensable's for my ankles. I have a freaking piece of bone floating around in my left ankle for piss sakes. Anyways, I'm trying not to lose my cool. I'm working with the PEB lawyers down at Balboa as I have worked with him in the past. He seems to think that 40% DoD is where it should be, since the VA rated my back and the PEB didn't.

I'm just sick of waiting to "start" my civilian life...

This turned in to a bitch fest real quick, haha.

Were you in the Wounded Warrior BN / warrior recovery unit? Somehow they've kept me in a squadron, but eventually they're going to have to move me out so they can get another pilot. I'm not sure where I'll spend the next 4-6 months.
 
I'll definitely be requesting a VARR as it turns out I tore my right rotator cuff pulling the parking brake in the MV-22 up--how's that for ergonomics. From what their saying I might have to have surgery, they also gave me a bunch of non-compensable's for my ankles. I have a freaking piece of bone floating around in my left ankle for piss sakes. Anyways, I'm trying not to lose my cool. I'm working with the PEB lawyers down at Balboa as I have worked with him in the past. He seems to think that 40% DoD is where it should be, since the VA rated my back and the PEB didn't.

I'm just sick of waiting to "start" my civilian life...

This turned in to a bitch fest real quick, haha.

Were you in the Wounded Warrior BN / warrior recovery unit? Somehow they've kept me in a squadron, but eventually they're going to have to move me out so they can get another pilot. I'm not sure where I'll spend the next 4-6 months.

I tried getting over to WWB. I waited too long unfortunately. Once enrolled in IDES the WWB will typically reject you (my rejection letter from WWB stated this). There is a program available to WII service members to intern at a federal agency near the PDS, link below.

You may want to wait until after surgery, but it beats having nothing productive to do at an operational unit IMO.

I was able to add my back as unfitting at the FPEB.

A Marine I met through the internship was in a Seps BN, which I believe exists mostly for attaching separating members from OCONUS assignments. Not sure if that is an option for CONUS IDES members.

I can see how many deploy-able units wanting us out ASAP, but that's not reality for us nor them.

http://download.militaryonesource.m...upport/OperationWarfighterProgramOverview.pdf
 
So I met with the PEB lawyer today and the strategy going forward is to have the IVDS added as an unfitting condition. The VA rated it at 20%, so that will put me over the 30% mark. I really want to pursue the PLMS, but he is strenuously advising me to solely focus on having the IVDS added as unfitting. I really feel that the PLMS is unfitting, but could be a red herring for the PEB.

Here's to waiting....
 
So I met with the PEB lawyer today and the strategy going forward is to have the IVDS added as an unfitting condition. The VA rated it at 20%, so that will put me over the 30% mark.
Without more context/info, this makes sense.

As always, the facts and circumstances of each person's case drive the outcome. You are looking for evidence supporting each condition significantly impacting your ability to perform your duties in fighting for an unfit finding for each condition that you contend make you unfit.

I really want to pursue the PLMS, but he is strenuously advising me to solely focus on having the IVDS added as unfitting. I really feel that the PLMS is unfitting, but could be a red herring for the PEB.
See my above comments. That said, do you have facts or evidence that support that your Periodic Limb Movements of Sleep is unfitting? Also, I don't know how many years of service you have, what your grade is, or how- if you "win" on the other issues- the additional condition will help you. I am suggesting/asking whether if you win on the IVDS issue, whether any additional finding, including PLMS, will matter. The resolution of that issue is important to weighing the best course of action for you.

Here's to waiting....

Yup...that is the deal...the process takes time, sometimes too much time and you can torture yourself with worry about this.

I often feel that the answer to "how long does it take" to get an answer is analogous to the answer to the question of "how long is a length of string?" The answer is to the latter is "however long it is." Same answer as to how long it takes to get a final result- it takes as long as it takes.

I hope all goes well for you and you get a good/desired result. Best of luck. Any other questions, please let us know.

Jason
 
I'm an O-3 (in zone for O-4) with 9yrs 6mo of service. I'm a pilot, so a lot of things that may not be unfitting for some MOS make me unfit in the cockpit, but maybe not necessarily at a desk. The biggest problem I have right now is that the PEB, whether by omission or on purpose, didn't even comment on one of my referred conditions - IVDS, which the VA rated at 20% (ROM on C&P exam was 40 degrees, so they rated it correctly).

As far as the PLMS, I had a sleep study done because of excessive daytime sleepiness. I have a periodic limb movement index of something like 47 movements per hour and my time in REM sleep is substantially lower than the norm. I currently take medication to help me sleep. The PEB cited the SECNAVINST 1850.4E 3307 Standards and criteria not normally to be used as the sole basis for determination of fitness or unfitness, Section C, "The inability to perform specialized duties or loss of special qualification, i.e. aviation, parachuting, or diving will not be the sole basis for a finding of Unfitness"

I think they bought off on this a bit too much. My MOS is to be a pilot. It's not like I'm a mechanic who has an Aerial Observer qualification.

Assuming I "win" the addition of the IVDS which will retire me, the only benefit of fighting this battle would be a higher monthly payment and for what I'd call "justice." I'm not sure this is a hill I want to die on, however.

As I said, the PEB lawyer strenuously advised me not to pursue the addition of the PLMS as an unfitting condition. I'm inclined to take his advice unless my neurologist can make a strong case. I'm 90% not going to fight them on the PLMS. I am going to talk to the neurologist about having it recharacterized as a "convulsive tic" because the VA didn't even rate the PLMS, not even using an analogous code for a related sleep disorder (i.e.: sleep apnea, etc) nor did they rate my restless leg syndrome.

So, being at 90% I feel that if I can get to the "retired" category, I can fight with the VA for increasing ratings on certain things that will bump me to the 100% category. That increase in benefits would outweigh the percentage of getting the PLMS added, unless they gave me some crazy percentage which I don't think they would do.
 
Just updating this thread.

I appeared before my FPEB last Thursday in DC and it went as well as could hope for. My counsel and I thought they would stipulate as they adjourned for a recess and took about 40 minutes following the introduction of some new evidence, one of which was a iPhone video. Following that turn of events, most of the questions were what I would call, "confirmation" questions.

I think they'll have no choice but to find in my favor since we definitely went above and beyond the "preponderance of evidence"

Now I'm back at the waiting game...which I'm horrible at. :(
 
I talked to the PEB section up in DC yesterday and a nice dude tracked down my package. He said the board has already voted and adjudicated my case. So hopefully it's already in the legal review and QA process. He thinks I should hear something within the next week or so.
 
Glad your getting some answers. I'm still in the waiting phase. My FPEB was on 27 October and I still haven't gotten any word back. Stressing out
 
Got word today!

30% DoD / 90% VA (proposed) PDRL

I'm so relieved to have something finally swing my way! Thanks for everyone's advice and support throughout this process.

I hope I can repay the "knowledge debt" that I owe this place.
 
Got word today!

30% DoD / 90% VA (proposed) PDRL

I'm so relieved to have something finally swing my way! Thanks for everyone's advice and support throughout this process.

I hope I can repay the "knowledge debt" that I owe this place.
Congratulations enjoy your well deserved retirement and happy thanksgiving
 
Got word today!

30% DoD / 90% VA (proposed) PDRL

I'm so relieved to have something finally swing my way! Thanks for everyone's advice and support throughout this process.

I hope I can repay the "knowledge debt" that I owe this place.
Indeed, this is outstanding news; congratulations on the receipt of favorable PEB findings! :D Take care! :cool:

Thus, I quite often comment that "possessing well-informed knowledge is truly a powerful equalizer!"

Best Wishes!
 
Got word today!

30% DoD / 90% VA (proposed) PDRL

I'm so relieved to have something finally swing my way! Thanks for everyone's advice and support throughout this process.

I hope I can repay the "knowledge debt" that I owe this place.

Congrats on the good news!

I have seen some of your previous posts and have a similar background (i.e. Pilot with back problems) and would be interested to get your perspective on what my future has in store.

I have had major lower back pain for the better part of the last 4 years, however I have been doing everything I could to fight through it. I consulted with flight doc's for the past 4 years to try to solve the problem while staying within flight status. Between physical therapy, the chiropractor and near daily pain pill (approved by flight doc) I could make it through the day with the occasional cancelled flight due to back pain. However, recently the pain has increased in intensity and frequency and got to the point that I felt it had become too distracting to fly safely.

I called uncle to the flight doc and said I had to get taken off the flight schedule for a bit. I have been downed for about 2 months now.

I was sent to get an MRI and I am waiting on an appointment with a specialist. From the flight docs interpretation of the MRI he suggested that my only route back to the cockpit is to get surgery and then demonstrate that I have recovered fully and that I am free from pain.

I saw you mentioned in a different post that being disqualified from flying doesn't make you unfit. What does this mean for a pilot, will they stick me behind a desk forever?

I am hesitant to get surgery due to the horror stories I have read, and what seems like limited success rate in fixing the back pain (everyone seems to have the same amount of pain, plus the added issues with complications from the surgery).

Have a great Thanksgiving!
 
Got word today!

30% DoD / 90% VA (proposed) PDRL

I'm so relieved to have something finally swing my way! Thanks for everyone's advice and support throughout this process.

I hope I can repay the "knowledge debt" that I owe this place.


Got my FPEB back Monday morning.
30% DOD.
Low Back Pain DDD (stable) 20%, Lumbar Radiculopathy (Stable) 10%.
Both Cat 1 unfitting. Approved Permanent Disabled Retirement List.

VA 70% lawyer recommends submitting a VA reconsideration to get the % increased.

Feeling pretty stoked after a very long process. (Oct 2015-Nov 2016).
 
Congratulations! I would second the lawyer's advice since a VARR will take weeks, instead of months as a veteran.
 
I saw you mentioned in a different post that being disqualified from flying doesn't make you unfit. What does this mean for a pilot, will they stick me behind a desk forever?

Correct. I'm not sure which service you are in, but for Navy and Marine Corps personnel, the SecNav 1850.4E is the "bible" as far as this process is concerned. I haven't read the rationale behind my FPEB members' decisions yet, but the IPEB cited the SECNAVINST 1850.4E 3307 'Standards and criteria not normally to be used as the sole basis for determination of fitness or unfitness', Section C, "The inability to perform specialized duties or loss of special qualification, i.e. aviation, parachuting, or diving will not be the sole basis for a finding of Unfitness"

However, if they would've read 3 paragraphs down it clearly states that conditions "not normally unfitting" can combine to cause an unfit finding.

My advice for you would be to start gathering documentation in preparation for a MEB. Keep in mind that if you have multilevel spine surgery, in the naval services, you're done flying. It is considered downing, waiver not considered or something like that. Hence, I only had one level done.

Got my FPEB back Monday morning.
30% DOD.
Low Back Pain DDD (stable) 20%, Lumbar Radiculopathy (Stable) 10%.
Both Cat 1 unfitting. Approved Permanent Disabled Retirement List.

VA 70% lawyer recommends submitting a VA reconsideration to get the % increased.

Feeling pretty stoked after a very long process. (Oct 2015-Nov 2016).

Gunny, that is the same thing they gave me. Funny how my arthritic hip suddenly became cured and not unfitting (it was in the IPEB)...praise Jesus!!! I'm cured! I'm not sure what I'm going to do with respect to a VARR or PFR. My wife and I are completely done w/ this process.

It was never about the money, but even if they added back my hip I'd only be at 40% DoD, which doesn't make much of a difference monetarily.
 
Yea. I was fighting to have the radiculopathy 10% added to the backs 20%. They originally rated radiculopathy as a CAT 3 not unfitting. My entire chain was like WTF. (I walk with a cane)

IPEB was 20% sep w/o Benifits and with severance which would have equaled 125K. I would rather have healthcare for myself and family.

My new ROM should bring the 20% to 40%.
 
Correct. I'm not sure which service you are in, but for Navy and Marine Corps personnel, the SecNav 1850.4E is the "bible" as far as this process is concerned. I haven't read the rationale behind my FPEB members' decisions yet, but the IPEB cited the SECNAVINST 1850.4E 3307 'Standards and criteria not normally to be used as the sole basis for determination of fitness or unfitness', Section C, "The inability to perform specialized duties or loss of special qualification, i.e. aviation, parachuting, or diving will not be the sole basis for a finding of Unfitness"

However, if they would've read 3 paragraphs down it clearly states that conditions "not normally unfitting" can combine to cause an unfit finding.

My advice for you would be to start gathering documentation in preparation for a MEB. Keep in mind that if you have multilevel spine surgery, in the naval services, you're done flying. It is considered downing, waiver not considered or something like that. Hence, I only had one level done.

Thanks for the knowledge!
I am Navy as well, I read through 1850.4E and see 3307. I see that not being able to remain in aviation won't be the sole reason, however, is there a clear description of what they will use to assess your fitness to serve? What is the criteria they use to judge your fitness? Does this vary from PEB to PEB (based on the opinion of the board members)?

Also, not sure if you would know, however I see that it can take over a year at times to complete the full process. If this goes beyond my PRD how do they work that? Will they PCS me to a new command to remain on timeline while I go through the process? Will they do this assuming that by the end I will be found fit?

Hope you had a great Thanksgiving.
 
Thanks for the knowledge!
I am Navy as well, I read through 1850.4E and see 3307. I see that not being able to remain in aviation won't be the sole reason, however, is there a clear description of what they will use to assess your fitness to serve? What is the criteria they use to judge your fitness? Does this vary from PEB to PEB (based on the opinion of the board members)?

Also, not sure if you would know, however I see that it can take over a year at times to complete the full process. If this goes beyond my PRD how do they work that? Will they PCS me to a new command to remain on timeline while I go through the process? Will they do this assuming that by the end I will be found fit?

Hope you had a great Thanksgiving.

The PEB is woefully undereducated when it comes to the aviation side of the house. They kept asking me if I could be the S-1 officer, Aviation Maintenance Officer, etc. I don't think they know that in a squadron all those billets are filled by pilots. Anyways, I'm just ranting. They'll look at your ability to perform other duties outside your MOS / rate, and it seems these opinions --- and they're just that, opinions---vary from PEB to PEB.

You will not be PCS'd if you are in the IDES process, but you may be PCA'd or reassigned within the same area as long as you can still get to your MTF.
 
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