What does 100% P&T mean? Can you still work or go to school?

brohammer

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I received this during my second eval, due to having symptoms return and it caused an issue with my ability to work where I was. Am I still able to work or go to school now? I was worse than I thought. Will I be re-evaluated in the future? Thanks. Just to note I do not have IU on this rating. It is pysch related, so I am still not sure if I am allowed to work.

Also, if you need to go to another state for a school or job, will the VA be ok with it, if you already started a treatment plan for the state you are in? I told them initially I planned to stay in my current state, but after researching the school I was looking at, I found it was not accredited and am thinking about going elsewhere.
 
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oddpedestrian

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No, but if you file any additional claims in the future they can review your MH and with going to school or having a career it could hurt you otherwise no.
 

gsfowler

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I received this during my second eval, due to having symptoms return and it caused an issue with my ability to work where I was. Am I still able to work or go to school now? I was worse than I thought. Will I be re-evaluated in the future? Thanks. Just to note I do not have IU on this rating. It is pysch related, so I am still not sure if I am allowed to work.

Also, if you need to go to another state for a school or job, will the VA be ok with it, if you already started a treatment plan for the state you are in? I told them initially I planned to stay in my current state, but after researching the school I was looking at, I found it was not accredited and am thinking about going elsewhere.
If you are rated 100% P&T, it is exactly that. PERMANENT and TOTAL. You are not subject to re-evaluation unless a gross, negligent error was made in the evaluation, or there was fraud.

You are able to work or go to school without any consequences. You can move wherever you want.

I am 100% P&T. I went to school using vocational rehabilitation, I did non-paid work experience internships using vocational rehabilitation. I moved from California to Hawaii. I have been gainfully employed for greater than 2 years while being rated and have never missed a single check from the VA.
 

oddpedestrian

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If you are rated 100% P&T, it is exactly that. PERMANENT and TOTAL. You are not subject to re-evaluation unless a gross, negligent error was made in the evaluation, or there was fraud.

You are able to work or go to school without any consequences. You can move wherever you want.

I am 100% P&T. I went to school using vocational rehabilitation, I did non-paid work experience internships using vocational rehabilitation. I moved from California to Hawaii. I have been gainfully employed for greater than 2 years while being rated and have never missed a single check from the VA.
That's actually completely untrue you do not have a protected 100% P&T rating unless you had it for 20 years....furthermore many P&T vets make a common mistake of filing a new claim after being 100% usually some SMC type claim and then the VA can review your disabilities again so its actually not P&T until you have it for 20 years.
 

chaplaincharlie

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This is what the VA says
§3.342 Permanent and total disability ratings for pension purposes.

(a) General. Permanent total disability ratings for pension purposes are authorized for disabling conditions not the result of the veteran’s own willful misconduct whether or not they are service connected. (Authority: 38 U.S.C. 1502(a))

(b) Criteria. In addition to the criteria for determining total disability and permanency of total disability contained in §3.340, the following special considerations apply in pension cases:

(1) Permanent total disability pension ratings will be authorized for congenital, developmental, hereditary or familial conditions, provided the other requirements for entitlement are met.

(2) The permanence of total disability will be established as of the earliest date consistent with the evidence in the case. Active pulmonary tuberculosis not otherwise established as permanently and totally disabling will be presumed so after 6 months’ hospitalization without improvement. The same principle may be applied with other types of disabilities requiring hospitalization for indefinite periods. The need for hospitalization for periods shorter or longer than 6 months may be a proper basis for determining permanence. Where, in application of this principle, it is necessary to employ a waiting period to determine permanence of totality of disability and a report received at the end of such period shows the veteran’s condition is unimproved, permanence may be established as of the date of entrance into the hospital. Similarly, when active pulmonary tuberculosis is improved after 6 months’ hospitalization but still diagnosed as active after 12 months’ hospitalization permanence will also be established as of the date of entrance into the hospital. In other cases the rating will be effective the date the evidence establishes permanence.

(3) Special consideration must be given the question of permanence in the case of veterans under 40 years of age. For such veterans, permanence of total disability requires a finding that the end result of treatment and adjustment to residual handicaps (rehabilitation) will be permanent disability of the required degree precluding more than marginal employment. Severe diseases and injuries, including multiple fractures or the amputation of a single extremity, should not be taken to establish permanent and total disability until it is shown that the veteran after treatment and convalescence, has been unable to secure or follow employment because of the disability and through no fault of the veteran.

(4) The following shall not be considered as evidence of employability:

(i) Employment as a member-employer or similar employment obtained only in competition with disabled persons.

(ii) Participation in, or the receipt of a distribution of funds as a result of participation in, a therapeutic or rehabilitation activity under 38 U.S.C. 1718. (Authority: 38 U.S.C. 1718(f))

(5) The authority granted the Secretary under 38 U.S.C. 1502(a)(2) to classify as permanent and total those diseases and disorders, the nature and extent of which, in the Secretary judgment, will justify such determination, will be exercised under §3.321(b).

(c) Temporary program of vocational rehabilitation training for certain pension recipients.

(1) When a veteran under age 45 is awarded disability pension during the period beginning on February 1, 1985, and ending on December 31, 1995, the Vocational Rehabilitation and Employment Division will be notified so that an evaluation may be made, as provided in §21.6050, to determine that veteran’s potential for rehabilitation.

(2) If a veteran secures employment within the scope of a vocational goal identified in his or her individualized written vocational rehabilitation plan, or in a related field which requires reasonably developed skills and the use of some or all of the training or services furnished the veteran under such plan, not later than one year after eligibility to counseling under §21.6040(b)(1) of this chapter expires, the veteran’s permanent and total evaluation for pension purposes shall not be terminated by reason of the veteran’s capacity to engage in such employment until the veteran has maintained that employment for a period of not less than 12 consecutive months. (Authority: 38 U.S.C. 1524(c))


[26 FR 1586, Feb. 24, 1961, as amended at 26 FR 9674, Oct. 13, 1961; 29 FR 3624, Mar. 21, 1964: 39 FR 14944, Apr. 18, 1974; 46 FR 47541, Sept. 29, 1981; 50 FR 52775, Dec. 26, 1985; 53 FR 23235, June 21, 1988; 55 FR 17271, Apr. 24, 1990; 56 FR 25044, June 3, 1991; 56 FR 65851, Dec. 19, 1991; 58 FR 32445, June 10, 1993; 66 FR 44053, Aug. 22, 2001]


Supplement Highlights reference: 8(2c).
 
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gsfowler

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§ 3.327 Reexaminations.

(a)General. Reexaminations, including periods of hospital observation, will be requested whenever VA determines there is a need to verify either the continued existence or the current severity of a disability. Generally, reexaminations will be required if it is likely that a disability has improved, or if evidence indicates there has been a material change in a disability or that the current rating may be incorrect. Individuals for whom reexaminations have been authorized and scheduled are required to report for such reexaminations. Paragraphs (b) and (c) of this section provide general guidelines for requesting reexaminations, but shall not be construed as limiting VA's authority to request reexaminations, or periods of hospital observation, at any time in order to ensure that a disability is accurately rated.

(Authority: 38 U.S.C. 501)

(b)Compensation cases -

(1)Scheduling reexaminations. Assignment of a prestabilization rating requires reexamination within the second 6 months period following separation from service. Following initial Department of Veterans Affairs examination, or any scheduled future or other examination, reexamination, if in order, will be scheduled within not less than 2 years nor more than 5 years within the judgment of the rating board, unless another time period is elsewhere specified.

(2) No periodic future examinations will be requested. In service-connected cases, no periodic reexamination will be scheduled:

(i) When the disability is established as static;
(ii) When the findings and symptoms are shown by examinations scheduled in paragraph (b)(2)(i)of this section or other examinations and hospital reports to have persisted without material improvement for a period of 5 years or more;
(iii) Where the disability from disease is permanent in character and of such nature that there is no likelihood of improvement;
(iv) In cases of veterans over 55 years of age, except under unusual circumstances;
(v) When the rating is a prescribed scheduled minimum rating; or
(vi) Where a combined disability evaluation would not be affected if the future examination should result in reduced evaluation for one or more conditions.

(c)Pension cases. In nonservice-connected cases in which the permanent total disability has been confirmed by reexamination or by the history of the case, or with obviously static disabilities, further reexaminations will not generally be requested. In other cases further examination will not be requested routinely and will be accomplished only if considered necessary based upon the particular facts of the individual case. In the cases of veterans over 55 years of age, reexamination will be requested only under unusual circumstances.
 
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brohammer

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That's actually completely untrue you do not have a protected 100% P&T rating unless you had it for 20 years....furthermore many P&T vets make a common mistake of filing a new claim after being 100% usually some SMC type claim and then the VA can review your disabilities again so its actually not P&T until you have it for 20 years.

I have heard of this as well. It is not etched in stone from what I gather until you hit that 20 year mark, but it is not so likely you will get re-rated once you are P&T
 

brohammer

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If you are rated 100% P&T, it is exactly that. PERMANENT and TOTAL. You are not subject to re-evaluation unless a gross, negligent error was made in the evaluation, or there was fraud.

You are able to work or go to school without any consequences. You can move wherever you want.

I am 100% P&T. I went to school using vocational rehabilitation, I did non-paid work experience internships using vocational rehabilitation. I moved from California to Hawaii. I have been gainfully employed for greater than 2 years while being rated and have never missed a single check from the VA.

Ok, that is good news, I still have that military mentality of having to stay were I am currently being seen. I may have to move for job/school. I am glad I am still able to work or go to school without being penalized.
 

Hawkeye99

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§ 3.327 Reexaminations.

(a)General. Reexaminations, including periods of hospital observation, will be requested whenever VA determines there is a need to verify either the continued existence or the current severity of a disability. Generally, reexaminations will be required if it is likely that a disability has improved, or if evidence indicates there has been a material change in a disability or that the current rating may be incorrect. Individuals for whom reexaminations have been authorized and scheduled are required to report for such reexaminations. Paragraphs (b) and (c) of this section provide general guidelines for requesting reexaminations, but shall not be construed as limiting VA's authority to request reexaminations, or periods of hospital observation, at any time in order to ensure that a disability is accurately rated.

(Authority: 38 U.S.C. 501)

(b)Compensation cases -

(1)Scheduling reexaminations. Assignment of a prestabilization rating requires reexamination within the second 6 months period following separation from service. Following initial Department of Veterans Affairs examination, or any scheduled future or other examination, reexamination, if in order, will be scheduled within not less than 2 years nor more than 5 years within the judgment of the rating board, unless another time period is elsewhere specified.

(2) No periodic future examinations will be requested. In service-connected cases, no periodic reexamination will be scheduled:

(i) When the disability is established as static;
(ii) When the findings and symptoms are shown by examinations scheduled in paragraph (b)(2)(i)of this section or other examinations and hospital reports to have persisted without material improvement for a period of 5 years or more;
(iii) Where the disability from disease is permanent in character and of such nature that there is no likelihood of improvement;
(iv) In cases of veterans over 55 years of age, except under unusual circumstances;
(v) When the rating is a prescribed scheduled minimum rating; or
(vi) Where a combined disability evaluation would not be affected if the future examination should result in reduced evaluation for one or more conditions.

(c)Pension cases. In nonservice-connected cases in which the permanent total disability has been confirmed by reexamination or by the history of the case, or with obviously static disabilities, further reexaminations will not generally be requested. In other cases further examination will not be requested routinely and will be accomplished only if considered necessary based upon the particular facts of the individual case. In the cases of veterans over 55 years of age, reexamination will be requested only under unusual circumstances.
Do we know how the VA defines "static" and "permanent in character?" What is the difference?
 

gsfowler

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static means there is no change
permanent in character means the VA has given you a permanent rating
 

gsfowler

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§ 3.340 Total and permanent total ratings and unemployability.
(a)Total disability ratings -

(1)General. Total disability will be considered to exist when there is present any impairment of mind or body which is sufficient to render it impossible for the average person to follow a substantially gainful occupation. Total disability may or may not be permanent. Total ratings will not be assigned, generally, for temporary exacerbations or acute infectious diseases except where specifically prescribed by the schedule.

(2)Schedule for rating disabilities. Total ratings are authorized for any disability or combination of disabilities for which the Schedule for Rating Disabilities prescribes a 100 percent evaluation or, with less disability, where the requirements of paragraph 16, page 5 of the rating schedule are present or where, in pension cases, the requirements of paragraph 17, page 5 of the schedule are met.

(3)Ratings of total disability on history. In the case of disabilities which have undergone some recent improvement, a rating of total disability may be made, provided:

(i) That the disability must in the past have been of sufficient severity to warrant a total disability rating;

(ii) That it must have required extended, continuous, or intermittent hospitalization, or have produced total industrial incapacity for at least 1 year, or be subject to recurring, severe, frequent, or prolonged exacerbations; and

(iii) That it must be the opinion of the rating agency that despite the recent improvement of the physical condition, the veteran will be unable to effect an adjustment into a substantially gainful occupation. Due consideration will be given to the frequency and duration of totally incapacitating exacerbations since incurrence of the original disease or injury, and to periods of hospitalization for treatment in determining whether the average person could have reestablished himself or herself in a substantially gainful occupation.

(b)Permanent total disability. Permanence of total disability will be taken to exist when such impairment is reasonably certain to continue throughout the life of the disabled person. The permanent loss or loss of use of both hands, or of both feet, or of one hand and one foot, or of the sight of both eyes, or becoming permanently helpless or bedridden constitutes permanent total disability. Diseases and injuries of long standing which are actually totally incapacitating will be regarded as permanently and totally disabling when the probability of permanent improvement under treatment is remote. Permanent total disability ratings may not be granted as a result of any incapacity from acute infectious disease, accident, or injury, unless there is present one of the recognized combinations or permanent loss of use of extremities or sight, or the person is in the strict sense permanently helpless or bedridden, or when it is reasonably certain that a subsidence of the acute or temporary symptoms will be followed by irreducible totality of disability by way of residuals. The age of the disabled person may be considered in determining permanence.

(c)Insurance ratings. A rating of permanent and total disability for insurance purposes will have no effect on ratings for compensation or pension.
 

Hawkeye99

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static means there is no change
permanent in character means the VA has given you a permanent rating
So, if at some point, a vet stops seeing the doctor for the condition (no additional medical records), will the VA look at the condition as 'static' since they can't see any evidence or documentation of change?
 

gsfowler

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Not going to see a physician would not be wise. Most veterans have a treatment care plan which includes bi-annual visits with their PCM at the minimum. If you have conditions that are not stable the PCM will typically address them.

The definition of static would be more like this. During your bi-annual visit with the PCM, he/she asks you if you are still using your CPAP at night. Your answer is yes. PCM documents this and condition is static.

On the other hand the PCM asks the same question and you answer, no, it does not work for me, I cannot sleep, the the PCM refers you to sleep medicine or pulmonology. You do not make an appointment for the referral because you are concerned about a rating change you read about on the internet. This would demonstrate that the condition is not static.
 

Hawkeye99

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Not going to see a physician would not be wise. Most veterans have a treatment care plan which includes bi-annual visits with their PCM at the minimum. If you have conditions that are not stable the PCM will typically address them.

The definition of static would be more like this. During your bi-annual visit with the PCM, he/she asks you if you are still using your CPAP at night. Your answer is yes. PCM documents this and condition is static.

On the other hand the PCM asks the same question and you answer, no, it does not work for me, I cannot sleep, the the PCM refers you to sleep medicine or pulmonology. You do not make an appointment for the referral because you are concerned about a rating change you read about on the internet. This would demonstrate that the condition is not static.
I guess what I really want to know... should someone that is rated P&T be concerned about the VA caring whether or not he or she sees a doctor on a regular/specific basis? From your initial post, I think no, but from the future examination criteria, I'm not so sure. I stopped using VA healthcare due to several horrible experiences.
 

gsfowler

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In my opinion, health is the the most important concerns. Whether or not you use VA healthcare, if you were medically retired due to a disability, it is in your best interest to monitor those conditions.

With a P&T rating, the VA will not re-examine you for compensation and pension, unless you request them to.
 
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