4th Period of Limdu STS1(SS)

batcheej said:
To everyone I need help in answering a question is there a requirement that actual range of motion measurements must be taken with a an actual measurement device as part of the MEBR submission to the PEB. SECNAV INSTRUCTION 1850.4E does not specifcally state how to measure range of motion for my medical condition (lumbar back problem) from what I have read. I have heard that the military is required to use the VA examination criteria and I asked the MTF doctor who did my physical examination for the PEB yesterday if actual measurements of my ROM needed to be taken and he said that he did not know but he would note that I had significant decreased ROM. No military medical provider has actually taken a ROM measurement with an actual measurement device for my condition is this right / acceptable? Thank you for you responses.

Also I am getting my impartial medical review but it is being done before the MEBR is complete does this make sense? Thanks again for responding.
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I was told that you had to have that done because that is how they determine what the navy will pay you and also help the VA in thier findings as well. I got my done at the OCS clinic on Quantico and i am not even sure what they all mean. But you should get a copy of your Package that went to the PEB, i know it took me forever becuase my PEBLO needs help and alot of training.
 
So I got a response to my rebuttal but it was not in accordance with any instruction that I can find. It was an e-mail from the [FONT=&quot]Patient Administration Program Advisor stating that the Convening Authority has determined " [/FONT] that he will terminate the current MEB report going to PEB. This decision was to allow a new provider to address your current concerns and to evaluate the current medical information not previously available to (the doctor who wrote the NARSUM/MEBR report). In addition the CA wants a provider that will be here for the full process. Your current copy of the MEB report is no longer valid as the CA has cancelled that local board report.
We will contact you for further appointments and or consults." Then I get an e-mail from the PEBLO yesterday that I have a limited duty reevaluation appointment on the 2nd of August. I thought the e-mail about my rebuttal was good news until I found out that I should have gotten something in writing directly from the CA. I have been advised that it appears that the Navy medical people are trying to cover up one doctor's negligence and unethical actions. Well we will see what happens at this appointment. I have also been advised that I should file a grievance U.S. Navy Regs. article 1150. I am unsure if should do this because I do not think it will change anything. I have also been told that after this appointment the medical provider I see tries to tell me that my case is not going to be referred to a IPEB I should file a complaint with the inspector general. I have also found some JAG points of contact for Navy members going through MEBS/PEBS.
 
Well here is the latest update to my story. Today I met my new provider that I was previously told would be re-doing my MEB report(NARSUM). Well she told me that she did not think that I needed a MED board and that in her opinion my case does not need to go to a PEB because she knows that it will be returned that I am fit for duty because I can definitely do something in the Navy not my old job but something like a desk job. As far as I know there are no permanent desk jobs in the Navy or any enlisted Navy rates that do not require at least some manual labor (basic seamanship, line handling, working parties stores loads all of which I can not do) So she went and got the Patient Administration Program Advisor to explain this to me because she thought that he could better explain the situation. So this person comes into and room and tells me that he sees this everyday. He also agrees that I am fit with limitations and that I could possibly be admin discharged because of this and that I should be trying to do a rate conversion, I told him that I can not convert to a new rate in my current status but he said well you start the process and as soon as you sign that you are fit for duty you'll be good to go. So I asked that my civilian neurosurgeon has stated and written that I am disabled and can only do a desk job. The Patient Administration Program Advisor responded that well he is a civilian and does not understand the military medical side and military laws. So the option was given to me to be evaluated by a Navy neurosurgeon in Bethesda. I agreed to this so this where I am at. I am going to contact the enlisted community managers of rates I think I have the best chance to convert into and plead my case to them and see if they are willing to pick me up which I doubt and I am seriously thinking about calling the inspector general since I have been told first that I was fit but unsuitable, appealed that, and then told my case was going to PEB, submitted a rebuttal to the included NARSUM because it was factually inaccurate, was told that NARSUM was being thrown out and the MEB was starting all over and now I am being told that I am fit again and my case does not warrant going to a PEB.
 
Batcheej, Sounds like your in the same boat i am with just a minor twist. My chain of command is saying they want me to stay in. Even said in the NMA. But medical is saying i shouldn't be in. I have just been put on my thrid LIMDU approved by BUPERS. I sent new 57 pages and new NARSUM paperwork to my new PEBLO in Bethesda to be sent off to the board because the one i was seeing didn't know anything. I even asked Jason on here and he said it's not unheard of for a PEB to be overturned. So i am hopeful. I am just wondering if you are going to the same MTF that i am. I don't know who you are going through but now they are also sending me through the Tele Nuero Clinic at bethesda. Just had a couple of MRI's done at Bethesda, becuase my injury has now moved from just my lower back to my neck. I work in Intelligence as an IS and i am not sure what your ASVAB scores are but you can try that route. Just a thought but like you said, the Navy doesnt just have desk jobs. I already talked to my detailor and he told me flat out i wouldn't stay at my current command that i would transfer but if i couldn't go back to sea or screen for that i might be administrativly seperated. I think that is crap. I have 14 years in and now they want to do that to me. That is why i am hoping my impact statement, which bascially said my chain of command didn't ask me any questions and assumed they knew what i was doing, changes the thinking of the board along with the 57 pages of new stuff and my new NARSUM addendum. I feel for you the Navy is bass ackwards with all that is going on. I know my injury was combat related but it happend while i was on ship, and always got told suck it up. Well now since i have been "Sitting behind a desk" it has gotten worse. Don't think that just because your behind a desk your inury will be better ok. I can attest that mine got worse. But i truly hope that Jason wins his case cause if i get seperated for this, i plan on talking to the IG and also Jason so i can get on that class action lawsuit. The Navy needs to realize if you can't go to sea you are "Unfit"
 
The Senate's version of the proposed Defense Authorization act for FY 2011 has a provision that a military member who is found "fit" by a PEB cannot then be administratively separated due to being non-deployable because of their medical condition. So what if the member is being told that his or her medical condition does not warrant referral to a PEB this circumvents a "fit" or "unfit" finding by a PEB and the member could then still be administratively separated. I believe that I could be subjected to this. as I am now being told that I do not require a MEB or referral to a PEB because my limitations do not prevent me from performing a desk job, yet my limitations will make me non-deployable and assignment limited. I have been told that if I am not world wide assignable (deployable) I will be subjected to an Administrative separation. My diagnosis and my limitations in my opinion meet the criteria of the Navy Disability Instruction SECNAVINST 1850.4 as well as the VASRD but this is not the opinion of an administrator at my MTF. My diagnosis are post-surgical residuals from a L4-L5, L5-S1 transformal interbody lumbar fusion, permnant medical imitations to prevent further injury due to my degenerative disc disease, a substantial loss of range of motion, and bilateral grade 3 patella chondromalicia which required me to have a left knee plica release/removal but it is the opinion of my PCM and the patient amdinistrator at my MTF that I am fit for "medically unrestricted duty" with limitations and can be subjected to admin separation and do not need to be referred to a PEB. Does this sound like a way to still admin separate someone without sending them to PEB when it appears that they should be sent to a PEB?
 
I would look at a case where a person was not sent to a PEB, but instead was admin discharged due to a disability as a wrongful discharge case (this starts to get complicated, because I would tend to think that it is also the basis for disability retirement claim, but in order to challenge that, you need to go to BCMR/BCNR first...so, I would weigh going after the wrongful discharge, which probably results in return to duty with back pay and then processing for an MEB/PEB, vs going to BCNR and then likely having to go to court after. Like I said, this can get complicated, and it is a decision that needs to be made after consideration of all the different issues).
 
First of all, I’m apologize for my poor English. I’m confuse now from this statement below. As I understand, if you found Non-Deployable then you should be rate disability by PEB. Why PEB say you Fit but Non-Deployable then they going to put you to administrative separation? Coz If you are Non-Deployable you should be rate for disability right? I am really sorry, I’m really confuse. :confused:

SECNAVINST 1850.4E
30 APRIL 2002
2-1 4 Enclosure (2)


2051 Non-Deployable

A determination made by service personnel authorities or local medical authorities
that the member has a medical condition (s) that temporarily or permanently prevents
positioning the member individually or as a part of a unit with or without prior notification
to a location outside the Continental United States for a specified period of time. The
inability to perform duties in every geographic location and under every conceivable
circumstance is not the standard to be used as the basis for making this determination.
Members who are determined to be non-deployable for a condition that is permanent in
nature and significantly interferes with his or her ability to perform the duties of office,
grade, rank or rating should be referred to the PEB for disability evaluation. While nondeployability
shall be one of many factors considered by the PEB in determining Fitness for
continued naval service, non-deployability alone will not normally constitute a basis for a
finding of Unfit to continue naval service. See paragraphs 2033 (Fit), 2085 (Unfit).
 
Just want to ask if you are admin sep from the navy will u still be able to get a separation pay, if you do how do they do the calculation. I know its off the topic.
 
STS1, recommend you give PERS-82 a call to discuss your case. 901-874-3230.
baliw1974 said:
Just want to ask if you are admin sep from the navy will u still be able to get a separation pay, if you do how do they do the calculation. I know its off the topic.
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