Mental Health DBQ - 3a? Symptoms? Section IV?

[18Blade]

Hello,

I received my MH DBQ today, and I'm trying to decipher it / how they VA actually assigns a percentage.

Is is *strictly* the box in 3a, without any consideration of the boxes that are checked in section III?

I'm very curious about this, because my block 3a is what I've read is the 50% rating, but in section III, I have seven blocks checked that fall under the 70% criteria (based on the VA's schedule of ratings). Then the section IV writeup reads like I'm a fully-functioning normal person. My MH issues date back to 2012, and are fully documented in my record (I'm still AD, going through MEDBOARD).

Obviously, this is a huge difference in rating, and then to my final percentage. Any insight to this is greatly appreciated.

Shaun

 

[Provis]

Hello,

I received my MH DBQ today, and I'm trying to decipher it / how they VA actually assigns a percentage.

Is is *strictly* the box in 3a, without any consideration of the boxes that are checked in section III?

I'm very curious about this, because my block 3a is what I've read is the 50% rating, but in section III, I have seven blocks checked that fall under the 70% criteria (based on the VA's schedule of ratings). Then the section IV writeup reads like I'm a fully-functioning normal person. My MH issues date back to 2012, and are fully documented in my record (I'm still AD, going through MEDBOARD).

Obviously, this is a huge difference in rating, and then to my final percentage. Any insight to this is greatly appreciated.

Shaun

View attachment 10976

Where is the rest of the DBQ? There is another section that has checkboxes that is a better indicator of your rating for this condition?

 

[18Blade]

Hey Provis,

Thank you for the reply.

Here is block 3a from my DBQ:



This part, combined with the items that are checked in section III, are the reason I made this thread. I understand that the above block suggests 50%...but many of the blocks checked in section III are in line with a 70%. I'm just hoping that the entirety of the DBQ is considered, not just the block in 3a.

Shaun

 

[tony292]

You have a good case for filing a VARR based on the 70% criteria met. Also ask your MH doctor who is treating you currently to fill out a dbq on your behalf.

 

[Provis]

Hey Provis,

Thank you for the reply.

Here is block 3a from my DBQ:

View attachment 10977

This part, combined with the items that are checked in section III, are the reason I made this thread. I understand that the above block suggests 50%...but many of the blocks checked in section III are in line with a 70%. I'm just hoping that the entirety of the DBQ is considered, not just the block in 3a.

Shaun

Box checked is 50%. Based on symptoms they could have checked the one below it which would have been 70%. I agree with @tony292 to have your provider that you are seeing fill out a DBQ themselves. Hopefully they check it one box lower. Then upload that along with the form for statement in support of claim to VA.gov.

 

[18Blade]

All,

Thank you for the replies. I don’t think I’m at that point yet; I don’t have a VA or DoD rating, I just received copies of all my DBQs. My package is being sent to the board for them to review and decide what to do with me, I was told I’ll get my rating when that package comes back, in about 3 months.

If my rating for MH comes back at 50%, then I may turn to outside assistance in getting it increased. I do agree that I have a strong case for 70%…and God knows I live with the difficulties in line with that rating.

My primary question here is does the VA really use just block 3a for their final rating? It seems illogical to include the rest of the info (like section III) if it has no impact on the decision..?

Or am I missing something?


Shaun

 

[18Blade]

I wanted to just edit my previous post, but it doesn't look like I can...possibly too much time has passed.

To put my main concern another way, I typed this up:



I realize I'm probably beating a dead horse at this point, but the irony is that the same symptoms I'm asking about here are the same ones that are preventing me from just letting it be. I probably won't sleep tonight, which is both funny and sad. This is definitely more stressful than I thought it would be.

In any case, this is the list of criteria for 70% from the schedule of ratings. My DBQ has 6 of the 9 checked (one of these, I believe, actually falls under the 100% criteria), which I would say objectively qualifies as "deficiencies in most areas." And if I'm being honest, the 4th criteria really should be checked, as well, on the depression side.

The more I think about it, I feel like the Doc who did my MH C&P exam maybe botched block 3a. This whole thing just doesn't make any sense...or the boxes that are checked on my DBQ don't align with each other. I can't rationalize how the documentation can show that one meets 67% of the criteria for a higher rating, but that one block for 3a is what matters. Silliness...but I guess that's the VA.

Regardless, I've already emailed my PEBLO about the VARR; What I've read about that so far, is that is something that would happen once I receive my actual rating back from the MEDBOARD. I think I'm definitely going to push for 70% if it comes back lower. I'm not really greedy...but that's a lot of money on the line.

Shaun

 

[Provis]

All,

Thank you for the replies. I don’t think I’m at that point yet; I don’t have a VA or DoD rating, I just received copies of all my DBQs. My package is being sent to the board for them to review and decide what to do with me, I was told I’ll get my rating when that package comes back, in about 3 months.

If my rating for MH comes back at 50%, then I may turn to outside assistance in getting it increased. I do agree that I have a strong case for 70%…and God knows I live with the difficulties in line with that rating.

My primary question here is does the VA really use just block 3a for their final rating? It seems illogical to include the rest of the info (like section III) if it has no impact on the decision..?

Or am I missing something?


Shaun

Create an account on VA.gov if you haven't already. There you will see your claims. You want to submit a competing DBQ filled out with correct symptoms and the box checked for a higher %. Its not too late or early. If you do this along with VA form 21-4138 explaining that your impairement is greater along with that DBQ it would counteract your DBQ created by the C&P exam. This is the time to do it! You want the VA rater to see it so that hopefully you get the correct rate to begin with.

If that condition is an unfitting condition and you don't get the rating you want you would then be eligible to appeal via a VARR. By doing it this way you are being proactive and given 2 chances instead of 1 to get the correct %. Also, if mental health isn't unfitting and you get the incorrect ratings you would have to wait until you are out and then appeal and that process could take a year or more.

 

[Provis]

I wanted to just edit my previous post, but it doesn't look like I can...possibly too much time has passed.

To put my main concern another way, I typed this up:

View attachment 10979

I realize I'm probably beating a dead horse at this point, but the irony is that the same symptoms I'm asking about here are the same ones that are preventing me from just letting it be. I probably won't sleep tonight, which is both funny and sad. This is definitely more stressful than I thought it would be.

In any case, this is the list of criteria for 70% from the schedule of ratings. My DBQ has 6 of the 9 checked (one of these, I believe, actually falls under the 100% criteria), which I would say objectively qualifies as "deficiencies in most areas." And if I'm being honest, the 4th criteria really should be checked, as well, on the depression side.

The more I think about it, I feel like the Doc who did my MH C&P exam maybe botched block 3a. This whole thing just doesn't make any sense...or the boxes that are checked on my DBQ don't align with each other. I can't rationalize how the documentation can show that one meets 67% of the criteria for a higher rating, but that one block for 3a is what matters. Silliness...but I guess that's the VA.

Regardless, I've already emailed my PEBLO about the VARR; What I've read about that so far, is that is something that would happen once I receive my actual rating back from the MEDBOARD. I think I'm definitely going to push for 70% if it comes back lower. I'm not really greedy...but that's a lot of money on the line.

Shaun

Also, I will send you some references for private attorneys. I would strongly consider hiring one. That is what my wife did and she got the best results. To get the most out of going this route you need to hire the attorney at the very beginning. They can help you with all the tricks of the trade and help strategize to add more conditions and or craft a compelling case for the condition to be designated combat related. It was amazing the peace of mind she had by know at each step her attorney would fill out the appeal paperwork and give it to her to submit to her PEBLO. He wrote up her commander's impact statement (commander was fine with my wife writing it up as it saved him some time) rebuttal to her NARSUM, FPEB Appeal and VARR. In the end her compensation was much greater than we had anticipated.

If you pay for an attorney that covers everything for a flat fee like my wife did you would also have legal representation during the 3 year TDRL process too. If one or more of your conditions are TDRL it means they can change and if its your only condition it could mean that down the road if things don't go your way you could end up being kicked out with severance even if initially you were found 30% or higher for an unfit condition.

 

[NHow20]

I wanted to just edit my previous post, but it doesn't look like I can...possibly too much time has passed.

To put my main concern another way, I typed this up:

View attachment 10979

I realize I'm probably beating a dead horse at this point, but the irony is that the same symptoms I'm asking about here are the same ones that are preventing me from just letting it be. I probably won't sleep tonight, which is both funny and sad. This is definitely more stressful than I thought it would be.

In any case, this is the list of criteria for 70% from the schedule of ratings. My DBQ has 6 of the 9 checked (one of these, I believe, actually falls under the 100% criteria), which I would say objectively qualifies as "deficiencies in most areas." And if I'm being honest, the 4th criteria really should be checked, as well, on the depression side.

The more I think about it, I feel like the Doc who did my MH C&P exam maybe botched block 3a. This whole thing just doesn't make any sense...or the boxes that are checked on my DBQ don't align with each other. I can't rationalize how the documentation can show that one meets 67% of the criteria for a higher rating, but that one block for 3a is what matters. Silliness...but I guess that's the VA.

Regardless, I've already emailed my PEBLO about the VARR; What I've read about that so far, is that is something that would happen once I receive my actual rating back from the MEDBOARD. I think I'm definitely going to push for 70% if it comes back lower. I'm not really greedy...but that's a lot of money on the line.

Shaun

I have a similar scenario with my MH DBQ, most of my symptoms check are higher then what they put in box 3a. Hopefully they do their due diligence and see that it should’ve been a higher choice in 3a

 

[18Blade]

Also, I will send you some references for private attorneys. I would strongly consider hiring one. That is what my wife did and she got the best results. To get the most out of going this route you need to hire the attorney at the very beginning. They can help you with all the tricks of the trade and help strategize to add more conditions and or craft a compelling case for the condition to be designated combat related. It was amazing the peace of mind she had by know at each step her attorney would fill out the appeal paperwork and give it to her to submit to her PEBLO. He wrote up her commander's impact statement (commander was fine with my wife writing it up as it saved him some time) rebuttal to her NARSUM, FPEB Appeal and VARR. In the end her compensation was much greater than we had anticipated.

If you pay for an attorney that covers everything for a flat fee like my wife did you would also have legal representation during the 3 year TDRL process too. If one or more of your conditions are TDRL it means they can change and if its your only condition it could mean that down the road if things don't go your way you could end up being kicked out with severance even if initially you were found 30% or higher for an unfit condition.

Hi Provis,

All great info, thank you! I did respond to your message, but I'll continue here so that others might benefit from some of the details.

I do have a VA account, but right now, it just says that I don't have a VA rating, and that I have no claims on file.

I don't know the logistical process for claims as they pertain to a MEDBOARD. Obviously I've had all of my C&P exams, and my PEBLO contacted me yesterday to let me know that she was sending me all of the findings via DoD Safe. So maybe at this point in the process, the VA rater has not seen my results? I really couldn't say, I just know that my VA account doesnt show any details or claims info.

As far as the 3-year TDRL, I'm currently just under 21 years of continuous AD service. The 23rd of this month will be the 21-year mark, actually. I've been told that if you are going through a MEDBOARD and you are over 20 years, they will generally put you on TDRL and medically retire you. My EAOS is May of next year, so really, there isn't much difference in terms of actual retirement vs medical retirement dates. Kind of funny how it worked out that way, but at least the IDES process allows me to get the VA stuff in place while I'm wearing the uniform.

I've reached out to my civilian Doc to request an additional appointment to explain the DBQ to him. Unfortunately, he is generally really busy, and he is not savvy with military / VA / et al, so it might be a process, but we'll see.

Shaun

 

[Provis]

Hi Provis,

All great info, thank you! I did respond to your message, but I'll continue here so that others might benefit from some of the details.

I do have a VA account, but right now, it just says that I don't have a VA rating, and that I have no claims on file.

I don't know the logistical process for claims as they pertain to a MEDBOARD. Obviously I've had all of my C&P exams, and my PEBLO contacted me yesterday to let me know that she was sending me all of the findings via DoD Safe. So maybe at this point in the process, the VA rater has not seen my results? I really couldn't say, I just know that my VA account doesnt show any details or claims info.

As far as the 3-year TDRL, I'm currently just under 21 years of continuous AD service. The 23rd of this month will be the 21-year mark, actually. I've been told that if you are going through a MEDBOARD and you are over 20 years, they will generally put you on TDRL and medically retire you. My EAOS is May of next year, so really, there isn't much difference in terms of actual retirement vs medical retirement dates. Kind of funny how it worked out that way, but at least the IDES process allows me to get the VA stuff in place while I'm wearing the uniform.

I've reached out to my civilian Doc to request an additional appointment to explain the DBQ to him. Unfortunately, he is generally really busy, and he is not savvy with military / VA / et al, so it might be a process, but we'll see.

Shaun

If you have 20 or more active duty years of service none of this matters. You have maxed out compensation as long as your total VA rating is 50%. The max you can get by law is the combination of your longevity earned pension and VA disability.

So getting all of your VA ratings correct is the most important to include that condition. At some point in VA.gov you will see a claim. You can open it and it will have all your combined conditions lumped into one claim. There is an option to upload documents to that claim. That is where you upload a competing DBQ with your statement in support of a claim form.

 

[18Blade]

Not to bring up an old thread, but what did you end up receiving OP?

Nothing wrong with bringing up an old thread as far as I'm concerned.

So the short answer is I'm still waiting. I don't retire until the end of May, so I'll receive my rating at some point after that. I'll definitely update this thread regarding whether or not it was in line with the DQB.

There is a "however", though:

I actually have 2 DBQ's for all of my issues, including mental health. Long story. I say that because what my actual rating for MH ends up being could very well be a result of both of them combined...but we'll see what happens.

The general concensus seems to be that the VA will use the most recent DBQ, and if that's the case, my rating might be higher than what the DQB in my OP (and other posts in this thread) have shown.

Are you waiting on your own rating right now?