Transfer From CB-WTU (HOR) to WTU (125 miles) HOME SALE

[nwlivewire]

I have a question and need an answer.

Someone told me about a program that the DoD has that allows for a "subsidy" of some type if you sell your house for less than what you owe on it because you have to transfer from one location to another.

I'm wanting to find out more information about this program - does it really exist? What are the qualifications needed to receive this benefit - if it does exist.

I have been assigned to my HOR in the CB-WTU program for 18 mths now. I have just been referred to an MEB and have been told that I will have to transfer back to Fort Lewis, WA for the remainder of my journey through the MEB/PEB process. I have been told that this process could take up to another year.

My HOR is Portland, Oregon - this is where I have been assigned to this last 18 months - and when I transfer from my HOR to Ft. Lewis, WA., that will be a move of 125 miles.

I am a single Soldier - no dependants (widow), but own a home in Portland, Oregon. I have been living in my home since my transfer to CB-WTU in SEP 2008.

If I put my home up for sale when the Army transfers me back to Fort Lewis, and if I don't get enough money from the proceeds of the sale to pay off my mortgage, can I use that DoD program that makes up the difference so I don't go under financial water any more than I already am?

Do I even qualify for this DoD program? Does this program exist? Can a Wounded Warrior use this program?

Thanks for your answer. I sure coud use a break about now.
nwlivewire

 

[seneca]

Its called the Homeowners Assistance Program (Homeowners' Assistance Program - Department of Defense)
The basics of the program: Benefits - Homeowners' Assistance Program - Department of Defense
This has examples, with numbers: http://hap.usace.army.mil/Documents/HAP_Expansion_18Mar2010.pdf
Here are the conditions you must meet: Expanded HAP for WT and Surviving Spouses (SS) of fallen warriors - Homeowners' Assistance Program - Department of Defense

For members of the Armed Forces – Those who receive a disability rating of 30% or more for an unfitting condition (using the Department of Veterans Affairs Schedule for Ratings Disabilities), or who are eligible for Service member’s Group Life Insurance Traumatic Injury Protection Program, or whose treating physician (in a grade of at least captain in the Navy or Coast Guard or colonel in Army or Air Force) certifies that the member is likely, by a preponderance of the evidence, to receive a disability rating of 30% or more for an unfitting condition (using the Department of Veterans Affairs Schedule for Ratings Disabilities) for wounds, injuries, or illness incurred in the line of duty while deployed, on or after September 11, 2001.

For both military and civilian applicants there must be a need to relocate from the primary residence in furtherance of medical treatment, rehabilitation, or due to medical retirement resulting from the wound, injury, or illness, and a need to market the primary residence for sale due to the wound, injury or illness.

They call the "prior fair market value" of your home, the price that you paid for it. I'm certainly not an expert, but it did seem like if you were upside down at all, this would help. And they will also pay your closing costs (but not your realtor fees). We have a considerable amount of equity in our home, so IF we can ever get our orders cut to a WTU, we were looking at using a private program, through ERA. (After 120 days the HAP will pay off your mortgage or pay you 75% of your purchase price, the ERA program will pay you 90% of the current appraised value after 180 days, so we come out ahead with the latter, if we can't sell).

Hope that helps!

 

[nwlivewire]

WOW!

Thank-you so very much for all this data! This might be my saving grace to get out of this upside-down situation I'm in.

I've a few questions.

Let's pretend for a minute and give you a hypothetical. Hope you have an answer.

Let's say I bought the house for 100,000.00 I now owe 99,000.00.

Let's say the house is now worth 75,000.00 in today's market and I get an offer for 75,000.00

As you wrote: After 120 days the HAP will pay off your mortgage or pay you 75% of your purchase price.

QUESTION:

How do the HAP people determine which way they will go on payment on my home? How do they determine whether they would pay off the balance (99,000) or pay the 75% of purchase price (75,000)? I'm lost on that one.

Would they pay the difference between what the house sells for and what I owe?

And does this have ANY ADVERSE effect on my credit rating?

QUESTION 2:

What is the ERA and how does one qualify for that? I have an FHA loan.

And thank-you again for all your helpfulness!

nwlivewire

 

[seneca]

WOW!

Thank-you so very much for all this data! This might be my saving grace to get out of this upside-down situation I'm in.

I've a few questions.

Let's pretend for a minute and give you a hypothetical. Hope you have an answer.
I'm happy to give you the answers as I understand them, but obviously, you'll want to double check with the HAP people:
HAP Field Office, Sacramento
U.S. Army Engineer District, Sacramento
1325 J Street
Sacramento, CA 95814-2922
916-557-6850
800-811-5532

Let's say I bought the house for 100,000.00 I now owe 99,000.00.

Let's say the house is now worth 75,000.00 in today's market and I get an offer for 75,000.00
If you get and accept an offer on your home, the formula is:
90% of the purchase price - sale price + closing costs (7% of the sale price)
So that would be:
90,000 - 75,000 + 5250, or $20250
Since you owe 24000 more than the sale price, the HAP program giving you the $20250, would leave you a deficit, $3750, that I'd assume you have to bring to closing.

As you wrote: After 120 days the HAP will pay off your mortgage or pay you 75% of your purchase price.

QUESTION:

How do the HAP people determine which way they will go on payment on my home? How do they determine whether they would pay off the balance (99,000) or pay the 75% of purchase price (75,000)? I'm lost on that one.
From the website, and their examples, it says :

Government Acquisition: When not able to sell home within 120 days, and approved by HQUSACE, applicant eligible to receive the greater of:
75% of the purchase price
OR
Mortgage payoff

So in your example, they'd pay off your mortgage. It does say "approved" and you have to demonstrate that you made a "reasonable effort" to sell your home:

Your primary residence must be listed, actively marketed, and available for purchase for a minimum of 120 days. With regard to marketing, up must demonstrate that the asking price was within the current market value of the home as determined by the CoE automated value model (AVM) for no less than 30 days. It is your responsibility to explain marketing efforts by detailing how the asking price was gradually reduced until it reached the true current fair market value (i.e., maintaining a log containing date and asking price recorded over period of time indicating number of visits by prospective buyers and offers to purchase). If you are unable to sell the primary residence, the CoE will determine whether efforts to sell were reasonable.

Would they pay the difference between what the house sells for and what I owe?
From what I understand, no, not unconditionally. They'll pay the difference between 90% of what you purchased the home for and what it sells for, plus they'll pay your closing costs. In your example, you still owe more than 90% of the purchase price, so they'll still be some difference (although a much smaller one), between what they pay you and what you need to pay off your mortgage.
And does this have ANY ADVERSE effect on my credit rating?
I do not know for sure, I know that people who participated in loan modification programs (like the Making Homes Affordable program), did see there credit scores drop, but I wasn't under the impression that this would negatively impact your credit score.

QUESTION 2:

What is the ERA and how does one qualify for that? I have an FHA loan.
Sorry, ERA is just the real estate company. ERA Seller Security Plan - ERA Real Estate They offer a program through their realtors. In your above example, you are much better off with the HAP. For us, after we purchased our home, we finished the second floor ourselves, with cash. So our home appraises for about 100K more than our mortgage, that is not our problem. Our problem is that there are already 5 homes on our street for sale, and 3 of them have been on the market for 300+ days.

And thank-you again for all your helpfulness!

nwlivewire

Hope I explained that all clearly. On the application page How to Apply - Homeowners' Assistance Program - Department of Defense there are samples for the private sale and government acquistion applications, too.

Seneca

 

[nwlivewire]

Thank-you again Seneca!
Dear Seneca:
I have gone to the sites you annotated and have downloaded applications.
Have made contact with a realtor.
Will be calling Sacrmento, CA ACE tomorrow.
Getting the ball rolling.
Again, thank-you so much for the info and for pointing me in the right direction.
v/r,
nwlivewire

 

[nwlivewire]

I made contact with the Western State Region HAP Office in Sacramento, CA. I spoke with Ty Chamberlain, who is the Wounded Warrior liaison for the EXPANDED HAP FOR WOUNDED WARRIORS in this region of the US. We spoke for about 20 minutes.

He said WWs get processed in about 90 days. IF a WW meets all the criteria, and submits ALL the paperwork, then the government will BUY OUT the mortgage. No need to put house on the market and go through all the rest of the riga-mo-role. But there are qualifying criteria for this, so those who need more information, please go to their web site to see if you qualify.

The only problem is that although I do qualify for this program IF and WHEN I could transfer back to Fort Lewis from my Home of Record (HOR), my Command (CB-WTU) DOES NOT have a NON-PUNITIVE way to transfer me back to Fort Lewis so I can use this program!

In other words, currently, MY CB-WTU ONLY has the ability to transfer a Soldier from their HOR to Fort Lewis IF they have received UCMJ action, and/or the Soldier is no longer is able to meet CB-WTU program requirements. They currently DO NOT have a mechanism/policy in place to transfer a "GOOD" Soldier back to Fort Lewis.

I believe my Command will be wanting to do the right thing here. I just wonder if all they need to do is just write up a one page memo or policy letter so that Soldiers like me can then transfer back to Fort Lewis and make use of this HAP Expanded Program for Wounded Warriors.

I wonder who would be the decision-maker (s) at Fort Lewis to get this added into their policy? I'm not sure what or who to go to on this. But I sure need this HAP program and sure wish my command could pull a trigger to make this happen for me - and for other Soldiers who may be in similar circumstances and may be unaware of this program.

Any suggestions from anyone out there?
v/r, nwlivewire

 

[nwlivewire]

Well......

After numerous requests to transfer to Ft. Lewis, for the express purpose of receiving military medical care and being able to off-load my mortgage early so as to avoid foreclosure/bankruptcy once I TDRL and my income goes way down, my CB-WTU command has decided that they will only assist me when i get my MEB/PEB disability rating - which will be months from now.

Meanwhile, I continue to make mortgage payments, utility payments and barely get by. OH, and they say to me right now to be sure to start saving money for my future.

WTF!!! If i didn't have the darned mortgage and utility bills i could save money.

***********

So today, my command sent me an email message about contaminated eggs and a food recall notice. That was the last straw for me.

I snapped!!! I have had it with this outfit and i fired back an email to those folks who call themselves Soldiers.


here's what i wrote:


This is great about food we CANNOT or SHOULD NOT EAT. How about an email about FREE food WE CAN EAT.
God knows I can use the FREE food as winter is coming and my utility bills are going to TRIPLE!!!

Guess I can go out this winter and EAT the GRASS in my back yard.

OH. To wish for the PRIVILEDGE of edible FRESH VEGETABLES and FRUITS in AMERICA.

Oh. That's right. I'm in America - where there's a chicken in every pot and food a-plenty. And the Army helps their own in a timely manner - NOT!!!

Oh, but never mind. I'll just keep making my house payments on a mortgage I cannot afford.when I TELL YOU I NEED HELP NOW -
I am VERY disgusted with all of this. The ARMY's lack of timely consideration of my REPEATED requests to get me OUT of my underwater mortgage PRIOR to my MEB/PEB disability rating - is a BIG JOKE. A BROKE JOKE.

SO MUCH FOR MY BEING ABLE TO PREPARE FOR MY REDUCTION OF INCOME AND TRANSITION PLANS.

Yeah. Big whoop. The "ARMY" will come to the Soldiers aide - but only when they have exausted all income - practically broke - AND TO HELL WITH TRANSITION.

WHAT IS IT??? SOMEONE IN THIS COMMAND JUST TOO DAMNED LAZY TO DO A LITTLE MORE PAPERWORK - now - IN ORDER TO HELP A SOLDIER now???


Thanks for your IMMEDIATE and TIMELY ASSISTANCE - NOT!

Maybe next year when I am under a bridge - those who SOOOOO claim to support VETERANS will FINALLY DO SOMETHING. I guarantee you, at the rate this situation is going, it WON'T be the ARMY. Because frankly, the ARMY hasn't given me a Rat's A** to ANY of my requests for IMMEDIATE assistance.

Meanwhile, I subsist - and NO THANKS to the ACTIVE US ARMY.

PLEASE. Make sure you tell me one more time to chat up to others NOT in ANY branch of the military about how GREAT the ARMY is. And HOW WELL they take care of THEIR SOLDIERS. What a farce!!! No wonder the general American public has grown weary of this war AND the fall-outs - i.e., the wounded, the disabled and the dead.

And if you don't like what I've written - remember, I fought in Iraq, too. I've been on active duty - OFF AND ON - SINCE 1980. NAVY and ARMY. I have the right to my opinions based upon my experience with the Active Army. I've paid my dues. I've paid my taxes AND served for almost 30- 40 YEARS. I have the right to call BU**SH** when I see it.

TO CB-WTU: I AM A CITIZEN SOLDIER. I DID NOT CHECK MY BRAIN IN AT THE DOOR WHEN I MOBILIZED.

Now, what does it mean to the ARMY when the ARMY says they DO NOT believe in leaving a Soldier behind? Does that phrase only count as long as that Soldier is able to repeatedly deploy without injury? And once injured, does the ARMY just do the least possible - and NOT be proactive - ESPECIALLY when the SOLDIER requests it. Oh - heaven forbid if the SOLDIER requests assistance and the Wounded Warrior Command has to do ONE MORE document of paperwork beyond what is MINIMALLY required.

Whatever. Let's just keep doing the LEAST possible for the SOLDIER. Heaven forbid that SOMEONE - an OFFICER PERHAPS - has to do ONE MORE LITTLE BIT of PAPERWORK to help their Soldier make it through to civilian status again. With FICO score intact.

Shame on you all. And I say this because if YOU are NOT part of the solution - then YOU are part of the PROBLEM.

You know. I've seen and visited almost 50 countries around the world since I've been an ADULT US Citizen - non-military. And that's BEFORE I went to Iraq. I've worked in coal mines and power plants - and that's when it was unknown for a female to work in these occupations. I've built libraries and parking lots and performed nuclear shut-down maintainence and built freeways, too. And that's just for starters. And THEN I went to college, THEN had a baby, and THEN raised that baby BOY to become another good social citizen. "And ain't I a WOMAN?" (Famous words from a slave-woman - go Google it and you'll know who I';m talking about. And if you don't already know - shame on your NOT knowing American History that includes Blacks, too).

I've seen friends die first-hand - up close and personal. Suddenly and without warning. And family members, too - Mother and Father. I've lost my husband - watched him die, too. I even had to make the decision to pull the plug on him. You try that one on for size and see how that feels. I will forever grieve the loss of this man - big hole in my heart.

And every day since then, I've struggled every day to make my life right-side-up now - and financially, it's hard. And i can hardly wait until winter comes and my bills will simply go up and up - as they have every winter these past three years.

You (MY COMMAND) could get me out of this mortgage and all its other bills right now - by transfering me to Ft. Lewis. BUT NO. This Command has decided to wait until I get my MEB/PEB notice of disability rating - many more months from now. I protest this decision and ask for reconsideration.

At this point - who gives a SH** about my FICO score? I'm going under. All these next several months when I could be taking that mortgage money and all the money on winter heating bills and put SOME of it away toward my transition - OH NO. CAN'T HAVE THAT. Let's NOT give a SOLDIER a leg up when they need it the most. I just have to be BROKE AND PHYSICALLY BUSTED - AND THEN - maybe then - AFTER I'm BROKE - I'll get help from the ARMY. How flippin sad is this?

Thanks alot US ARMY. You have left an indelible impression on me - a Citizen-Soldier. Remind me to volunteer for another tour. And my children and grandchildren, too. I say this as my family has had at least one person involved in war since the Civil War. I am generation 5 - my Son is generation 6. Six continuous generations that i know of. And if I had the time to research further back - perhaps my family served even before the Civil War as my family Bible goes back to 1755 in the Americas.

I VOLUNTEERED TO SERVE MY COUNTRY AS HAVE MY FATHERS BEFORE ME. BUT I DIDN'T VOLUNTEER TO GO BANKRUPT. THIS IS WHERE MY COMMAND CAN IMMEDIATELY INTERVENE.

Thanks for taking care of your own in a timely manner. I am one - but many - of another inconvenient - albeit - invisible truth. You have treated my needs as if I am nothing more than a wad of chewed up gum on the bottom of your boot. I am nothing more than an irritating inconvenience for you. That's exactly how this Command comes across to me when I have had to interact with you to get ANY of my needs met.

Shame on you all who are presently annoyed! People who act like that don't deserve my loyalty - and frankly, if you're annoyed by this email - you don't deserve the job you're getting paid to PERFORM (operative word). That's NOT the ARMY I was lead to believe in.

Start walking your talk - Sorry if this has pissed any of you off. BUT if it has, then maybe you should find another job - and OUTSIDE of the ARMY.

LEAD - FOLLOW - OR GET OUT OF THE WAY.

BE PROACTIVE. LISTEN to what your Soldier has to say. Don't dismiss them out-of-hand and tell them they don't know what they're talking about when they offer you a thoroughly researched solution to a problem they are having that will create a WIN-WIN. Why offer YOUR Soldier a LOSE-LOSE when there can be a WIN-WIN?

Be open to your Soldiers. You do NOT own or hold all the knowledge at your disposal. You are a fool if you think you do.

Open your minds.
Open your hearts.
And BE the kind of Soldier the ARMY has asked all of us to be.

BE.
KNOW.
DO.

Heads
Hearts
Hands

If the shoe fits - wear it. If not - then DO something NOW - NOT months from now.

"'Tis better to receive sharp criticism from a friend - than kisses from an enemy" (paraphrased from the Old Testament book of Proverbs - written by King Soloman)

I hope I'm not brought up on charges in the UCMJ for speaking my mind in this email. But only weak egos would go that far.

v/r,
nwlivewire

*******

I do not know WHY this command is so bloody constipated, ignorant, and insensitive to the needs of the Soldier who is in their DIRECT care and command.
What is so hard about getting me transferred and making it easier on me to survive this transition?

With winter coming and heating bills about to triple this winter on me, they say hang on until I get a disability rating, then they can pull the trigger.

Meanwhile, my command says to me to save my money (WHAT MONEY????) 25.00 a month?

I am so disgusted, I feel like throwing in the towel and just giving up. To hell with my credit. Just stop paying my bills and my mortgage and put that money in the bank so i can have some savings for later.

Thanks alot US ARMY. You really know how to take care of your own.

Can hardly wait to see how the Army takes care if it's own during the MEB/PEB process.

end of rant